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No more upsets
Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2025 7:48 pm
by Cro-Magnon App
The era of exciting football is over. No more days of small conference teams upsetting the big boys. The days of Temple beating VT, Navy beating South Carolina, Appalachian State shocking the world at Michigan and a few dozen others - used to be 3-4 of these a year, are over. Now there are no more experienced teams around that have developed their talent to pull the upset. As soon a good players are developed, they are bought out by the big money teams. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. The NCAA has killed the goose that laid the golden egg. The big schools wanted to monopolize the great talent and now they have done it. Now it is a very boring landscape. The excitement throughout the land that used to be at every football playing school has been doused. Money has killed it.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2025 9:04 pm
by Yosefus
I'm with on this. The haves and have not gap is so wide now with NIL will be nearly impossible.
Another thing I fear is a scandal with someone paying NIL to rig games. I have seen several head scratching plays, calls and penalties already this season with high level CFP teams that makes me wonder if that's not already the case.
We may find out one day it's all just championship wrestling.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2025 9:25 pm
by Cro-Magnon App
Yep. The mafioso has already appeared and got its hands in it. Rigging games. Gambling now is really gambling.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2025 9:45 pm
by WASU 93
If you want to add fuel to the fire, check out the P4 basketball standings. ALL BUT ONE of P4 teams + The Big East are .500 or better. At most, there are one or two teams per conference at at.500.
The ACC has three undefeated teams, 5 one loss teams and 4 more two loss teams.
In the Big 12, all 17 teams are 5-2 or better. Four are undefeated.
The Big East has four one loss teams and two teams at the bottom at .500.
The Big 10 has SEVEN undefeated teams.
In the SEC, fifteen of the sixteen teams are 5-2 or better, with Mississippi State at 3-4.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2025 9:52 pm
by appstatealum
Yosefus wrote: ↑Sat Nov 29, 2025 9:04 pm
I'm with on this. The haves and have not gap is so wide now with NIL will be nearly impossible.
Another thing I fear is a scandal with someone paying NIL to rig games. I have seen several head scratching plays, calls and penalties already this season with high level CFP teams that makes me wonder if that's not already the case.
We may find out one day it's all just championship wrestling.
Just because the stadiums, broadcasts, and majority of TV ads are branded by Fanduel and other sportsbooks doesnt mean....
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2025 10:06 pm
by Yosefus
appstatealum wrote: ↑Sat Nov 29, 2025 9:52 pm
Yosefus wrote: ↑Sat Nov 29, 2025 9:04 pm
I'm with on this. The haves and have not gap is so wide now with NIL will be nearly impossible.
Another thing I fear is a scandal with someone paying NIL to rig games. I have seen several head scratching plays, calls and penalties already this season with high level CFP teams that makes me wonder if that's not already the case.
We may find out one day it's all just championship wrestling.
Just because the stadiums, broadcasts, and majority of TV ads are branded by Fanduel and other sportsbooks doesnt mean....
Oh, Uh, Yeah. Ahem, excuse me......
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Sat Nov 29, 2025 10:22 pm
by MrCraig
The gambling stuff is legit worrying. It’s already been shown it’s affecting MLB and NBA.
But to the original point, there weren’t a lot of crazy upsets this year, but last season started with NIU upsetting Notre Dame. ODU beat VA Tech this year.
And how are you not excited by Vanderbilt and Indiana? NIL may have expanded the gap between G5 and P4, but it’s leveled things between the P4.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 7:56 am
by BeauFoster
Spent the weekend in Pinehurst with a big Wake donor. We had several long talks about the state of college athletics. He stated that he sees Wake as AAA baseball, with teams like App AA (can’t argue with him there on a macro scheme). Wake paid their 3rd string QB $75k this season, and is struggling to justify the university expenditure to fund NIL. There are already class action lawsuits over NIL, and that will hopefully expedite the push to more regulation in that area.
He’s given up his courtside seats for bball in Winston (or will be when his current contract ends), is considering giving up his suite for football, and stopped donating to NIL. His money is going to Cullowhee now, because they don’t participate in NIL like “big” schools do. He, like many, long for athletics of 10 years ago. He doesn’t disagree with NIL at all-the kids bring money in, they should get a cut of the revenue they generate (in the hundreds of millions for some of those programs), but high schoolers getting 7 figures is just stupid-no one with any sense wants to be part of it.
College athletics will be so markedly changed in 10 years that I’m not sure App football will even exist. That’s a bit hyperbolic, but once it truly becomes a minor league caste system, I’m not sure we can survive, at least not at the top level.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 8:43 am
by ArmantiWaterSafety
BeauFoster wrote: ↑Mon Dec 01, 2025 7:56 am
College athletics will be so markedly changed in 10 years that I’m not sure App football will even exist. That’s a bit hyperbolic, but once it truly becomes a minor league caste system, I’m not sure we can survive, at least not at the top level.
Not to get too off topic but I think it fits in this discussion and considering the football season is over might as well start bringing out-of-sport topics in. I think the idea of college in general will be so markedly changed in 10 years +/- 5 years that I think athletics will be an afterthought.
People are realizing the juice isn't worth the squeeze anymore for a good number of degrees we offer. Financial literacy is improving, and $35k for 4 years just for tuition (add on top room/board and food and according to the App State website, you're looking at about $85k) and low improved job outlook with a college degree doesn't help.
Real minimum wage keeps going up. 20-25 bucks an hour isn't out of the norm for an "unskilled labor" starting position anymore. Middle management jobs were the golden goose when the college degree was really pushed and those salaries are about as stagnant as ever. Companies are getting rid of the "college degree required" position.
Obviously, there are certain degrees which must continue to exist due to specialized knowledge, but I truly think we've reached the peak of enrollment. If enrollment declines, alumni decline, money declines, sports decline...it's a slippery slope and we've got to navigate it just like everyone else.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 9:05 am
by JTApps1
BeauFoster wrote: ↑Mon Dec 01, 2025 7:56 am
Spent the weekend in Pinehurst with a big Wake donor. We had several long talks about the state of college athletics. He stated that he sees Wake as AAA baseball, with teams like App AA (can’t argue with him there on a macro scheme). Wake paid their 3rd string QB $75k this season, and is struggling to justify the university expenditure to fund NIL. There are already class action lawsuits over NIL, and that will hopefully expedite the push to more regulation in that area.
He’s given up his courtside seats for bball in Winston (or will be when his current contract ends), is considering giving up his suite for football, and stopped donating to NIL. His money is going to Cullowhee now, because they don’t participate in NIL like “big” schools do. He, like many, long for athletics of 10 years ago. He doesn’t disagree with NIL at all-the kids bring money in, they should get a cut of the revenue they generate (in the hundreds of millions for some of those programs), but high schoolers getting 7 figures is just stupid-no one with any sense wants to be part of it.
College athletics will be so markedly changed in 10 years that I’m not sure App football will even exist. That’s a bit hyperbolic, but once it truly becomes a minor league caste system, I’m not sure we can survive, at least not at the top level.
I hope the entire system as it currently stands falls apart before we fall too far behind.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 2:09 pm
by MrCraig
ArmantiWaterSafety wrote: ↑Mon Dec 01, 2025 8:43 am
BeauFoster wrote: ↑Mon Dec 01, 2025 7:56 am
College athletics will be so markedly changed in 10 years that I’m not sure App football will even exist. That’s a bit hyperbolic, but once it truly becomes a minor league caste system, I’m not sure we can survive, at least not at the top level.
Not to get too off topic but I think it fits in this discussion and considering the football season is over might as well start bringing out-of-sport topics in. I think the idea of college in general will be so markedly changed in 10 years +/- 5 years that I think athletics will be an afterthought.
People are realizing the juice isn't worth the squeeze anymore for a good number of degrees we offer. Financial literacy is improving, and $35k for 4 years just for tuition (add on top room/board and food and according to the App State website, you're looking at about $85k) and low improved job outlook with a college degree doesn't help.
Real minimum wage keeps going up. 20-25 bucks an hour isn't out of the norm for an "unskilled labor" starting position anymore. Middle management jobs were the golden goose when the college degree was really pushed and those salaries are about as stagnant as ever. Companies are getting rid of the "college degree required" position.
Obviously, there are certain degrees which must continue to exist due to specialized knowledge, but I truly think we've reached the peak of enrollment. If enrollment declines, alumni decline, money declines, sports decline...it's a slippery slope and we've got to navigate it just like everyone else.
The higher education bubble has been blowing up for a long time. It will pop eventually, and it will be aided by a massive drop-off in students over the next few years. There was a baby bust when the economy crashed in 2008, and those kids are college aged now. There's literally not going to be enough college-aged people to keep every school open over the next 4-5 years. I think App will be fine, albeit changed, but smaller schools- especially private ones- aren't going to make it.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 4:18 pm
by Saint3333
Going to take a lot of foreign students to bridge the gap referenced above.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 4:29 pm
by Bigdaddyg1
The owners of major pro sports have long since figured out that fans are either stupid or just gullible. We pay for tickets no matter the price, purchase concessions at absolute ridiculous prices while athlete salaries skyrocket. Every now and then you see the random guy or group pronouncing that they will boycott the sports but that never lasts and it’s a minute minority who takes a stand.
A few folks say they won’t donate or buy tickets any longer because of how college athletics is “ruined”. While that’s probably what we should all do it ain’t gonna happen. The boycott guy will be replaced by gullible guy with more money than sense.
I believe I met the parents of that 3rd string QB. It’s truly amazing that the second and third tier P4 schools are pissing money away to maybe go 6-6.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 6:21 pm
by Cro-Magnon App
Many may go the way of Limestone College.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 6:23 pm
by Cro-Magnon App
Maybe the OP is off base. Maybe there will be more upsets. I watch the big teams play, and really, teams at all levels, and there are many times that some teams play like they just don’t care. We had a few games like that. A big team that’s going through the motions is vulnerable to getting beat.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Mon Dec 01, 2025 7:32 pm
by BeauFoster
Bigdaddyg1 wrote: ↑Mon Dec 01, 2025 4:29 pm
The owners of major pro sports have long since figured out that fans are either stupid or just gullible. We pay for tickets no matter the price, purchase concessions at absolute ridiculous prices while athlete salaries skyrocket. Every now and then you see the random guy or group pronouncing that they will boycott the sports but that never lasts and it’s a minute minority who takes a stand.
A few folks say they won’t donate or buy tickets any longer because of how college athletics is “ruined”. While that’s probably what we should all do it ain’t gonna happen. The boycott guy will be replaced by gullible guy with more money than sense.
I believe I met the parents of that 3rd string QB. It’s truly amazing that the second and third tier P4 schools are pissing money away to maybe go 6-6.
A smart AD takes it very seriously when a donor who has his name on multiple facilities starts cutting back tickets and donations. You don’t immediately replace that revenue stream.
Re: No more upsets
Posted: Tue Dec 02, 2025 2:00 pm
by AppOrange
We need a bold strategy to get after this or we are permanatly cooked. App developed HS talent for decades. Redshirting and finding "App" guys, even if they were not highly recruited who were studs by the time they were redshirt Sophmores or Juniors. For those saying build though HS recruting, how/why, by the time they make ther first splash they will be gone due to our lack of financial resources. Better to figure out the portal now and strive to keep up with the top of the G6. Our best bet is to get poached, then poach good FCS talent . . . rinse and repeat.